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1. Secftblgirl (secftblgirl@freespeechextremist.com)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 10:56:58 JST Secftblgirl
   Merriam-Webster just changed the definition of anti-vaxxerScreenshot_2021-10-07-17-26-59~2.png
   • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;; (shmibs@tomo.airen-no-jikken.icu)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 10:56:49 JST バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;

     in reply to

     • Infected Moomin
     • Plebeian Pillow Owner
     • Nudhul
     @Nudhul @Secftblgirl @Moon @mrsaturday what sides are there again?
   • Infected Moomin (moon@shitposter.club)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 10:56:50 JST Infected Moomin

     in reply to

     • Plebeian Pillow Owner
     @mrsaturday @Secftblgirl this is why the country is splitting in two, we can't even share a fucking dictionary
   • Nudhul (nudhul@shitposter.club)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 10:56:50 JST Nudhul

     in reply to

     • Infected Moomin
     • Plebeian Pillow Owner
     @Moon @mrsaturday @Secftblgirl which side has been doing the splitting again?
   • Plebeian Pillow Owner (mrsaturday@shitposter.club)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 10:56:51 JST Plebeian Pillow Owner

     in reply to
     @Secftblgirl Remember when Mazie Hirono made up a definition during the Kavanaugh hearings and the dictionary added the definition in 24 hours later to make her look good?
   • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;; (shmibs@tomo.airen-no-jikken.icu)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 11:03:34 JST バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;

     in reply to

     • Infected Moomin
     • Plebeian Pillow Owner
     @Moon @Secftblgirl @mrsaturday kory stamper's word by word is fun book2021-1633744991.png
   • Infected Moomin (moon@shitposter.club)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 11:03:35 JST Infected Moomin

     in reply to

     • Infected Moomin
     • Plebeian Pillow Owner
     @Secftblgirl @mrsaturday dictionaries aren't neutral but there's levels of how not-neutral something can be and they cranked the dial
   • Infected Moomin (moon@shitposter.club)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 11:03:36 JST Infected Moomin

     in reply to

     • Plebeian Pillow Owner
     @Secftblgirl @mrsaturday disagreeing is fine, it happens. using your privileged position to punish opponents in a public good utility is not fine, the people that do that shit are not moral people.
   • Secftblgirl (secftblgirl@freespeechextremist.com)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 11:03:37 JST Secftblgirl

     in reply to

     • Infected Moomin
     • Plebeian Pillow Owner
     @Moon @mrsaturday there's not enough neutral
   • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;; (shmibs@tomo.airen-no-jikken.icu)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 11:17:20 JST バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;

     in reply to

     • Infected Moomin
     • Plebeian Pillow Owner
     • Nudhul
     @Nudhul @Secftblgirl @Moon @mrsaturday mmm, sorry for rhetoric; just feels any time people mention "sides" it always falls into either "people who agree with me" and "evil people" or else "those idiots" and "those other idiots", but beyond that no one can agree where to draw any lines
   • Nudhul (nudhul@shitposter.club)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 11:17:21 JST Nudhul

     in reply to

     • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;
     • Infected Moomin
     • Plebeian Pillow Owner
     @shmibs @Moon @Secftblgirl @mrsaturday i dont even know. fascist i guess, and limp wristed zionist "conservatives"
   • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;; (shmibs@tomo.airen-no-jikken.icu)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 11:28:59 JST バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;

     in reply to

     • Infected Moomin
     • Plebeian Pillow Owner
     • Nudhul
     @Secftblgirl @Moon @Nudhul @mrsaturday so who is on the "freedom" team and who the "tyranny" team then?"freedom is democracy!" "freedom is a strong leader who does what i want" "freedom is when you all leave me alone and i live innawoods" "freedom is when people don't die from easily preventable/treatable diseases because lack of healthcare" etc. ask whoever and the answer is different
   • Secftblgirl (secftblgirl@freespeechextremist.com)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 11:29:00 JST Secftblgirl

     in reply to

     • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;
     • Infected Moomin
     • Plebeian Pillow Owner
     • Nudhul
     @shmibs @Nudhul @Moon @mrsaturday sure they can...Freedom > Tyranny
   • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;; (shmibs@tomo.airen-no-jikken.icu)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 11:35:16 JST バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;

     in reply to

     • Infected Moomin
     • Plebeian Pillow Owner
     • Nudhul
     • cirnog
     @cirnog @Secftblgirl @Moon @Nudhul @mrsaturday add it to the definitions pile
   • cirnog (cirnog@poa.st)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 11:35:17 JST cirnog

     in reply to

     • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;
     • Infected Moomin
     • Plebeian Pillow Owner
     • Nudhul
     @shmibs @Secftblgirl @Moon @Nudhul @mrsaturday Freedom is not having to chose between getting an experimental injection from people who openly hate you, and starving to death from being made unemployable.
   • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;; (shmibs@tomo.airen-no-jikken.icu)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 11:41:33 JST バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;

     in reply to

     • Infected Moomin
     • Plebeian Pillow Owner
     • Nudhul
     • cirnog
     @cirnog @Secftblgirl @Moon @Nudhul @mrsaturday > "people who agree with me" and "evil people"
   • cirnog (cirnog@poa.st)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 11:41:34 JST cirnog

     in reply to

     • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;
     • Infected Moomin
     • Plebeian Pillow Owner
     • Nudhul
     @shmibs @Moon @Nudhul @Secftblgirl @mrsaturday One side is just being blatantly evil you don't need to be a fence sitter.
   • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;; (shmibs@tomo.airen-no-jikken.icu)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 11:45:24 JST バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;

     in reply to

     • Infected Moomin
     • Plebeian Pillow Owner
     • Nudhul
     • cirnog
     @cirnog @Secftblgirl @Moon @Nudhul @mrsaturday some things other people think are evil are not things you think are evil, and the reverse. and sometimes there is overlap
   • cirnog (cirnog@poa.st)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 11:45:25 JST cirnog

     in reply to

     • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;
     • Infected Moomin
     • Plebeian Pillow Owner
     • Nudhul
     @shmibs @Moon @Nudhul @Secftblgirl @mrsaturday People who do Evil are are evil, people who oppose them are opposed to them, this isn't complicated and it's very stupid to act like it is.
   • cirnog (cirnog@poa.st)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 11:47:23 JST cirnog

     in reply to

     • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;
     • Infected Moomin
     • Plebeian Pillow Owner
     • Nudhul
     @shmibs @Moon @Nudhul @Secftblgirl @mrsaturday Some people think it's okay to mutilate kid's genitals, we call those people wrong and evil. Morality isn't subjective so it doesn't matter how many people are wrong about it.
   • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;; (shmibs@tomo.airen-no-jikken.icu)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 11:47:23 JST バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;

     in reply to

     • cirnog
     @cirnog lots of protestant christians / jews / muslims / sub-saharan africans think that's normal and good actually
   • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;; (shmibs@tomo.airen-no-jikken.icu)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 11:48:45 JST バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;

     in reply to

     • cirnog
     @cirnog they will declare their categorisation as strongly as you will yours. and other people will disagree with both of you
   • cirnog (cirnog@poa.st)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 11:48:46 JST cirnog

     in reply to

     • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;
     @shmibs Irrelevant. Lots of people can think pedophilia is good and they'd all be wrong and evil for thinking that.
   • cirnog (cirnog@poa.st)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 11:50:17 JST cirnog

     in reply to

     • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;
     @shmibs Okay I'll ask you, is child genital mutilation wrong? is raping a child wrong? is making a family chose between starvation and arbitrary medical experiments wrong?
   • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;; (shmibs@tomo.airen-no-jikken.icu)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 11:50:17 JST バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;

     in reply to

     • cirnog
     @cirnog my opinions are not relevant
   • cirnog (cirnog@poa.st)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 11:52:03 JST cirnog

     in reply to

     • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;
     @shmibs Yes they are, you can't be ambivalent about these easy questions.
   • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;; (shmibs@tomo.airen-no-jikken.icu)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 11:52:03 JST バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;

     in reply to

     • cirnog
     @cirnog i have strong opinions about them, but those opinions are not relevant
   • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;; (shmibs@tomo.airen-no-jikken.icu)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 11:55:07 JST バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;

     in reply to

     • cirnog
     @cirnog you are willfully blind to the point (which is the point
   • cirnog (cirnog@poa.st)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 11:55:08 JST cirnog

     in reply to

     • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;
     @shmibs If you're not going to condemn Evil then you de-facto support it. If you strongly opposed raping hcildren you would say so.
   • cirnog (cirnog@poa.st)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 12:02:42 JST cirnog

     in reply to

     • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;
     @shmibs The point is you're trying to pretend that being a fence-sitter is some intellectual position and that nobody can really understand what's right and wrong.I'm telling you it's easy and all you have to say is pedophilia is bad, but you refuse because being honest would torpedo your point.
   • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;; (shmibs@tomo.airen-no-jikken.icu)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 12:02:42 JST バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;

     in reply to

     • cirnog
     @cirnog i am not ambivalent or a 'fence-sitter', but my personal opinions are irrelevantthe assertion "i think X is the set of good things and Y the set of bad things, and this is an obvious universal truth" does not hold when there are millions of other people making the same assertion but each with a different X and Y. universal morality has no absolutes, only contested trends
   • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;; (shmibs@tomo.airen-no-jikken.icu)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 12:07:44 JST バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;

     in reply to

     • cirnog
     @cirnog morality IS what people believe
   • cirnog (cirnog@poa.st)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 12:07:45 JST cirnog

     in reply to

     • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;
     @shmibs >universal morality has no absolutesIs it wrong to rape a child, yes or no? Your consistent failure to answer easy questions is extremely relevant, it's my entire point that you're just pretending to hold a well reasoned opinion when it's clear to everyone you're a moral coward.Morality is objective, there's no situation in which torturing and decapitating your nephew is ever a moral good, but you would have us believe it is if enough people believe it
   • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;; (shmibs@tomo.airen-no-jikken.icu)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 12:09:22 JST バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;

     in reply to

     • cirnog
     @cirnog you are asking me about my personal belief as an attempt to prove morality is not a personal belief
   • cirnog (cirnog@poa.st)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 12:09:23 JST cirnog

     in reply to

     • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;
     @shmibs Last chance, is it wrong to rape a child yes or no?
   • cirnog (cirnog@poa.st)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 12:11:52 JST cirnog

     in reply to

     • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;
     @shmibs I'm asking you the moral equivalent of 2 + 2 = ?Nobody believes you can't fill in the blank.
   • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;; (shmibs@tomo.airen-no-jikken.icu)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 12:11:52 JST バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;

     in reply to

     • cirnog
     @cirnog this is going to turn into another platonism argument, and i think we already had one of those(?)
   • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;; (shmibs@tomo.airen-no-jikken.icu)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 12:14:40 JST バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;

     in reply to

     • cirnog
     @cirnog you're arguing for platonism right now, and i'm pretty sure we have before, mmm XX
   • cirnog (cirnog@poa.st)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 12:14:41 JST cirnog

     in reply to

     • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;
     @shmibs I don't think i've ever argued with you and you still haven't answered the question.child rape, wrong or not?
   • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;; (shmibs@tomo.airen-no-jikken.icu)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 12:22:11 JST バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;

     in reply to

     • cirnog
     @cirnog it is by definition, and both plato and neoplatonists like this guy: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Robert_Brownwould tell you so
   • cirnog (cirnog@poa.st)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 12:22:13 JST cirnog

     in reply to

     • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;
     @shmibs Objective morality isn't platonism you absolute retard.
   • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;; (shmibs@tomo.airen-no-jikken.icu)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 12:23:06 JST バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;

     in reply to

     • cirnog
     @cirnog you're mistaking your model of the world for the world itself
   • cirnog (cirnog@poa.st)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 12:23:07 JST cirnog

     in reply to

     • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;
     @shmibs Is it wrong to rape children?
   • cirnog (cirnog@poa.st)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 12:26:28 JST cirnog

     in reply to

     • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;
     @shmibs So you think it's good to rape children.
   • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;; (shmibs@tomo.airen-no-jikken.icu)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 12:26:28 JST バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;

     in reply to

     • cirnog
     @cirnog and making literally the plato's-slave-boy anamnesis argument
   • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;; (shmibs@tomo.airen-no-jikken.icu)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 12:32:47 JST バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;

     in reply to

     • Infected Moomin
     • Plebeian Pillow Owner
     • Fundamentally Broken Person #KillAllCommies :verified:
     • Nudhul
     @TheMadPirate @Secftblgirl @Moon @Nudhul @mrsaturday negative and positive there are anyways contextual with respect to an (arbitrarily drawn) baseline
   • Fundamentally Broken Person #KillAllCommies :verified: (themadpirate@freespeechextremist.com)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 12:32:48 JST Fundamentally Broken Person #KillAllCommies :verified:

     in reply to

     • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;
     • Infected Moomin
     • Plebeian Pillow Owner
     • Nudhul

     @shmibs @Secftblgirl @Moon @Nudhul @mrsaturday Be careful when you use the word “freedom”. Negative Liberty and Positive Liberty are two very different ideological position, yet both use the word “freedom” to defend their stance.

   • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;; (shmibs@tomo.airen-no-jikken.icu)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 12:37:13 JST バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;

     in reply to

     • Infected Moomin
     • Plebeian Pillow Owner
     • Nudhul
     @mrsaturday @Secftblgirl @Moon @Nudhul2021-1633750607.png
   • Plebeian Pillow Owner (mrsaturday@shitposter.club)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 12:37:14 JST Plebeian Pillow Owner

     in reply to

     • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;
     • Infected Moomin
     • Nudhul
     @shmibs @Secftblgirl @Moon @Nudhul "I should be free to maximize productivity and minimize cost from my employees as I choose.""I should be free from a work environment where I work 40-50 hours a week and still have to ask the question of if I can afford insurance.""I should be free from hearing harmful rhetoric and statements about what I am.""I should be free to say as I please, no matter who it upsets.""I should be free from ending up homeless due to an act-of-God disaster shocking the economy into a halt.""I should be free to enforce how contracts between me and my tenants are handled as I see fit.""I should be free from careless people behaving in ways that spread a disease that risks great harm to me.""I should be free to do as I please with my body and participate in commerce regardless of how my actions impact others."And so on. "Is it freedom" is a pretty dogshit metric to base how we rule on because freedom can mean anything to anyone, like you said. We had the right idea with the Bill of Rights putting definitions in place of what freedoms are and what we can expect, but the only part of the Bill of Rights that hasn't been out and out ignored by the state is the amendment prohibiting the government from forcing Americans to quarter soldiers in their homes, so it's not like that's worked either. What's sad is I don't think it will get any better anytime soon.
   • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;; (shmibs@tomo.airen-no-jikken.icu)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 12:51:04 JST バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;

     in reply to

     • Infected Moomin
     • Plebeian Pillow Owner
     • Fundamentally Broken Person #KillAllCommies :verified:
     • Nudhul
     @TheMadPirate @Secftblgirl @Moon @Nudhul @mrsaturday intentionality is itself fuzzy outside of mind-body dualism
   • Fundamentally Broken Person #KillAllCommies :verified: (themadpirate@freespeechextremist.com)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 12:51:05 JST Fundamentally Broken Person #KillAllCommies :verified:

     in reply to

     • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;
     • Infected Moomin
     • Plebeian Pillow Owner
     • Nudhul
     @shmibs @Moon @Nudhul @Secftblgirl @mrsaturday They are very different in praxeological terms, so the line is not arbitrarily drawn, it can very much be identified by a simple analysis of the situation at hand.
   • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;; (shmibs@tomo.airen-no-jikken.icu)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 13:11:48 JST バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;

     in reply to

     • Infected Moomin
     • Plebeian Pillow Owner
     • Fundamentally Broken Person #KillAllCommies :verified:
     • Nudhul
     @TheMadPirate @Secftblgirl @Moon @Nudhul @mrsaturday * my child should be free to give your child measles* i shouldn't be forced to have the child of my rapistetc
   • Fundamentally Broken Person #KillAllCommies :verified: (themadpirate@freespeechextremist.com)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 13:11:49 JST Fundamentally Broken Person #KillAllCommies :verified:

     in reply to

     • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;
     • Infected Moomin
     • Plebeian Pillow Owner
     • Nudhul

     @shmibs @Moon @Nudhul @Secftblgirl @mrsaturday “My Body, My Choice” mansplaining edition :

     • “I should be free to chose if I want to have the jab or not” -> Negative Liberty, does not impose what others should do or do not, freedom is based on individual choice and personal responsibility, rejects to conform to the idea of “security”.

     • “Abortions should be tax-payer founded so I can be free to do what I want with my body” -> Positive Liberty, imposes a condition on other people so they can feel “free” to act in a certain way, freedom depends on collective coercion, rejects individual choice and personal responsibility, uses the label “freedom” to mean security.

   • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;; (shmibs@tomo.airen-no-jikken.icu)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 13:15:21 JST バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;

     in reply to

     • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;
     • Fundamentally Broken Person #KillAllCommies :verified:
     @TheMadPirate that is to say, "an inaction is an action that has itself ramifications for others"
   • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;; (shmibs@tomo.airen-no-jikken.icu)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 13:17:12 JST バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;

     in reply to

     • Fundamentally Broken Person #KillAllCommies :verified:
     @TheMadPirate my response was that "not curtailing one persons" == "curtailing someone else's freedom"
   • Fundamentally Broken Person #KillAllCommies :verified: (themadpirate@freespeechextremist.com)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 13:17:13 JST Fundamentally Broken Person #KillAllCommies :verified:

     in reply to

     • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;
     • Infected Moomin
     • Plebeian Pillow Owner
     • Nudhul

     @shmibs @Moon @Nudhul @Secftblgirl @mrsaturday Yeah, Negative Liberty rejects the concept of security. If you acted in a way that puts you in danger, you have no reason to demand other people’s freedom to be curtailed. Positive Liberty does the opposite, demands other people’s actions to be restricted so you feel secure can operate in a way you believe things ought to be.

   • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;; (shmibs@tomo.airen-no-jikken.icu)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 13:19:53 JST バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;

     in reply to

     • Fundamentally Broken Person #KillAllCommies :verified:
     @TheMadPirate mmm, and response was that you may as well say "freedom means i am free to murder people". there is no meaningful difference between action and inaction
   • Fundamentally Broken Person #KillAllCommies :verified: (themadpirate@freespeechextremist.com)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 13:19:54 JST Fundamentally Broken Person #KillAllCommies :verified:

     in reply to

     • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;

     @shmibs Freedom for example means that I am free to refuse to help someone who is drowning, even if that leads to that person’s death. Sure, I can be accused of “involuntary manslaughter” ( whatever that means ) in some parts of the world, but that’s would be up to me to take personal responsibility. So yeah, Freedom doesn’t care about your feelings or needs.

   • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;; (shmibs@tomo.airen-no-jikken.icu)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 13:21:19 JST バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;

     in reply to

     • Fundamentally Broken Person #KillAllCommies :verified:
     @TheMadPirate when you are in a position to decide whether someone lives or dies, that person lives or dies according to your decision == you are responsible for that person's life or death
   • Fundamentally Broken Person #KillAllCommies :verified: (themadpirate@freespeechextremist.com)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 13:21:21 JST Fundamentally Broken Person #KillAllCommies :verified:

     in reply to

     • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;

     @shmibs That is simply not true. Just because I decide NOT to do something that implies I am stopping someone FROM doing something. The key word here is personal responsibility.

   • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;; (shmibs@tomo.airen-no-jikken.icu)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 13:23:22 JST バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;

     in reply to

     • Fundamentally Broken Person #KillAllCommies :verified:
     @TheMadPirate that definition is tautological. "people do the things they do"
   • Fundamentally Broken Person #KillAllCommies :verified: (themadpirate@freespeechextremist.com)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 13:23:23 JST Fundamentally Broken Person #KillAllCommies :verified:

     in reply to

     • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;

     @shmibs Freedom does indeed means you are free to murder people. Freedom doesn’t excuse you from the consequences off murdering other people, like for example, other people killing you as a reciprocate action.

   • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;; (shmibs@tomo.airen-no-jikken.icu)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 13:25:01 JST バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;

     in reply to

     • Fundamentally Broken Person #KillAllCommies :verified:
     @TheMadPirate mmm, now you're just introducing arbitrary caveatswhich is fine; everyone does it. but that was the initial point, that it's arbitrary
   • Fundamentally Broken Person #KillAllCommies :verified: (themadpirate@freespeechextremist.com)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 13:25:03 JST Fundamentally Broken Person #KillAllCommies :verified:

     in reply to

     • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;

     @shmibs Not unless that person is my dependent, in which case I am solely responsible for the wellbeing of that person. I am not responsible for the wellbeing of my group or my community, I am no total stranger’s keeper, they are not my responsibility.

   • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;; (shmibs@tomo.airen-no-jikken.icu)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 13:28:10 JST バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;

     in reply to

     • Fundamentally Broken Person #KillAllCommies :verified:
     @TheMadPirate yes of course; used the word in the colloquial sense of "lacking implication"
   • Fundamentally Broken Person #KillAllCommies :verified: (themadpirate@freespeechextremist.com)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 13:28:11 JST Fundamentally Broken Person #KillAllCommies :verified:

     in reply to

     • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;

     @shmibs Valid Logic is tautological. If the reasoning is not tautological then it’s a fallacy.

   • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;; (shmibs@tomo.airen-no-jikken.icu)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 13:29:22 JST バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;

     in reply to

     • Fundamentally Broken Person #KillAllCommies :verified:
     @TheMadPirate you're assigning positive and negative to the classes of actions you personally considered active or inactive, with an arbitrary personal set of criteria for differentiating the two
   • Fundamentally Broken Person #KillAllCommies :verified: (themadpirate@freespeechextremist.com)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 13:29:23 JST Fundamentally Broken Person #KillAllCommies :verified:

     in reply to

     • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;

     @shmibs My point is that there’s a criteria, a praxis, to delineate ( from the ontological positivist point-of-view also fuck nihilism ) when the word “freedom” is used to mean positive liberty and when it is used to mean “negative liberty”.

   • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;; (shmibs@tomo.airen-no-jikken.icu)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 13:42:13 JST バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;

     in reply to

     • Fundamentally Broken Person #KillAllCommies :verified:
     @TheMadPirate for every "active decision" X there is an "active decision" Y such that not Y == Xthere is no difference between "action" and "inaction" except one derived from personal (i.e. arbitrary) criteria
   • Fundamentally Broken Person #KillAllCommies :verified: (themadpirate@freespeechextremist.com)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 13:42:15 JST Fundamentally Broken Person #KillAllCommies :verified:

     in reply to

     • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;

     @shmibs It is not a “consideration”, it is based on observation. You observe someone’s behavior, and apply a criteria that allows you to identify you where that persons stands. The criteria is not arbitrary, it is very well defined.

   • Fundamentally Broken Person #KillAllCommies :verified: (themadpirate@freespeechextremist.com)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 13:47:35 JST Fundamentally Broken Person #KillAllCommies :verified:

     in reply to

     • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;

     @shmibs When I exercise my individual and economic freedom, the actions or inactions of other people do not enter into my sphere of consideration, irrespectively of whether such actions or inactions exists or not, unless they directly and purposefully initiate the use of force against me. That’s what “live and let live” means.

   • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;; (shmibs@tomo.airen-no-jikken.icu)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 13:47:35 JST バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;

     in reply to

     • Fundamentally Broken Person #KillAllCommies :verified:
     @TheMadPirate and that goes back to the startdecide not to take vaccinate child == decide to increase the risk of someone else getting measles
   • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;; (shmibs@tomo.airen-no-jikken.icu)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 13:54:43 JST バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;

     in reply to

     • Fundamentally Broken Person #KillAllCommies :verified:
     @TheMadPirate mmm, you're asserting there's a difference between actions and inactions again; we're going in circles
   • Fundamentally Broken Person #KillAllCommies :verified: (themadpirate@freespeechextremist.com)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 13:54:44 JST Fundamentally Broken Person #KillAllCommies :verified:

     in reply to

     • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;

     @shmibs No, that’s a false equivalence. The correct equivalence is : decide not to take vaccine child = individual risk of the child to get measles. Just because I decided not to act, that doesn’t mean other people can not take action to protect themselves. For example, if someone is poor, that’s the direct consequence of the life choices of that person that lead them to be poor, it is not the fault of “rich people” not “giving their fair share” ( or some idiotic crap like that ) to support the welfare state. Your example is just a cope out that irresponsible people use to excuse themselves from the consequences o their own behavior.

   • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;; (shmibs@tomo.airen-no-jikken.icu)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 13:57:49 JST バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;

     in reply to

     • Fundamentally Broken Person #KillAllCommies :verified:
     @TheMadPirate which necessitates there be a difference between action and inaction. but any given action can be rephrased as an exactly equivalent inaction, or vice versa
   • Fundamentally Broken Person #KillAllCommies :verified: (themadpirate@freespeechextremist.com)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 13:57:50 JST Fundamentally Broken Person #KillAllCommies :verified:

     in reply to

     • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;

     @shmibs I am asserting that my inaction doesn’t imply I am responsible for other people’s actions against themselves.

   • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;; (shmibs@tomo.airen-no-jikken.icu)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 14:04:29 JST バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;

     in reply to

     • Fundamentally Broken Person #KillAllCommies :verified:
     @TheMadPirate just apply a not operationto arbitrate, saying "but in this case it doesn't count", is to apply an extra set of rules you personally favour
   • Fundamentally Broken Person #KillAllCommies :verified: (themadpirate@freespeechextremist.com)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 14:04:30 JST Fundamentally Broken Person #KillAllCommies :verified:

     in reply to

     • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;

     @shmibs

     but any given action can be rephrased as an exactly equivalent inaction, or vice versa

     Not really. Someone’s inaction is not related to someone else’s actions against themselves. There is no equivalence there. Other people’s problems are someone else’s problems.

   • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;; (shmibs@tomo.airen-no-jikken.icu)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 14:05:04 JST バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;

     in reply to

     • Fundamentally Broken Person #KillAllCommies :verified:
     • Godcast
     @Godcast @TheMadPirate i am poor ._. (money received by doctor
   • Godcast (godcast@poa.st)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 14:05:07 JST Godcast

     in reply to

     • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;
     • Fundamentally Broken Person #KillAllCommies :verified:
     @shmibs @TheMadPirate I'll die if you don't give me $1,000 dollars this minute. You are now responsible for my death. Gimme a grand. Now.
   • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;; (shmibs@tomo.airen-no-jikken.icu)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 14:19:30 JST バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;

     in reply to

     • Fundamentally Broken Person #KillAllCommies :verified:
     @TheMadPirate mmm, now we're agreeing. the context for deriving positive and negative is arbitrary, a changeable definition. in the context of a single person's definition it is according to that single person's favour, and in a broader social context we can approximate an average context by statistical analysis of everyone's opinionswhat this means, though, is that you can't tell someone "you are wrong about your opinion", only "your opinion differs significantly from most peoples' opinions" (up until that person convinces a majority of others to change
   • Fundamentally Broken Person #KillAllCommies :verified: (themadpirate@freespeechextremist.com)'s status on Saturday, 09-Oct-2021 14:19:31 JST Fundamentally Broken Person #KillAllCommies :verified:

     in reply to

     • バツ子（痛いの痛いの飛んでけ;;

     @shmibs My point is that, what most rational people, understand as the concept of Freedom is based upon Negative Liberty, the idea that as long as you act according to your conscious and personal responsibility, you are free to act without interference from other people. That’s what is derived from human behavior when people use the concept of Freedom. It is not arbitrarily defined, not it subject to a zeitgeist, it is derived from observing human behavior itself.