Conversation
Notices
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@Moon "women who don't menstruate" is not some new phenomenon
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@lain @Moon what is it about then?some women have bodies that stop doing it; some women have bodies that never do it. it's not just a proper subset but one significantly smaller. and "menstrual health experiences" obviously only applies to people who menstruate
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@shmibs @Moon you know this isn't about that
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@lain @Moon and if the complaint is about including not-women who menstruate, then that seems feature rather than bug? if you're discussing bodies and medical research, it is good to be specific about them
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@lain @Moon if that's honest opinion then feel here honestly rather it's you being stupid
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@shmibs @Moon this is stupid and I'm not gonna talk about it
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@Moon if the reason is really "prefer to be inaccurate, but afraid to be honest about it" then is a little sad
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@shmibs @lain I guess this is good in science stuff sort of like how they don't say that gay people mostly get aids, it's "men having sex with men"on the other hand these people here are probably literally afraid to say woman
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@wowaname @Moon "birth sex" is not well defined biologically; only on paper
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@Moon @lain @shmibs thing is that even in science and medicine, people still refer to birth sex rather than properties of that sex, so "female" is still unambiguous in that contextremember, words cant have contextual meanings anymore
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@shmibs @wowaname most intersex people are only hormone imbalanced and doesn't have visible impact until later in life. I am not sure what to do with this data
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@Moon not sure what you mean by that, but "significant sex hormone imbalance" == "bodies that deviate significantly from the trends for sexual dimorphism", and if this deviation occurs before adulthood then it makes that deviation permanent. this happens because sexual dimorphism in mammals, including the bits considered primary and secondary sex characteristics (genital differentiation etc), are hormone-driven
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@Moon sorry, "makes that differentiation permanent" ought to be "makes some deviation permanent", with the degree being greater at earlier points in development, when more body-construction is happening, and slowing down through around 25 or so (though of course it's still possible for some permanent changes to happen after that point, growing e.g. breast tissue that can't be entirely ungrown afterwards
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@Moon in the context of medical care, a significant deviation is one that has significant ramifications for how that person will respond to medical care (diagnoses, drugs to use, procedures to perform, etc), and not all such significant deviations are obviously outwardly visible. can argue about where line-drawing should happen in terms of that, but "you look like a 〇〇 to me" isn't relevant
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@shmibs what i am saying is that imbalances that aren't enough to cause people to deviate from trends for sexual dimorphism are the majority of intersex. it's scientifically accurate but it skews common perception of how many people don't conform.
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@Moon and awareness of / greater accuracy with differences like this does matter, just like we need more accuracy with respect to differences in e.g. bodyweight, with doctors giving overdoses to skinny people
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@shmibs apparently this mainly impacts later in life like menopause age. that doesn't undermine anything you said though just that we don't consider menopausal women to be a separate sex. maybe we should, maybe that would be useful scientifically, I don't know. I think enough people conform to certain definitions that you can have a decent starting point when thinking about their individual health care.
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@Moon that would be useful, mmm, as an evolved third morph with significantly different phenotype (like how some spiders / elephant seals etc have a third morph for "sneaky female-looking males"and it's especially important to be careful in this case because humans have a very strong evolved bias for splitting the world into "people i can do sex with" and "people i can compete with" that needs to be consciously overridden
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lain
Infected Moomin
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